I dont know what to do. I am trying to decide on getting either a b18c1 swap or doing ls/vtec. i've heard that the ls/vtec isnt as reliable but it is much faster than the b18c1.please give some advice(pros,cons)
. im stuck!
Mods: JDM ITR FE conversion. All-motor goodies. Hondata system.
Re: B18C1 or ls/vtec
Quote:
Originally posted by integra11 I dont know what to do. I am trying to decide on getting either a b18c1 swap or doing ls/vtec. i've heard that the ls/vtec isnt as reliable but it is much faster than the b18c1.please give some advice(pros,cons)
. im stuck!
This is a quote from an integra forum thread titled: reliability of LS/VTEC
Randyman-
"the 'unrealiability' of the ls/vtec is way waaaay down in the dark ages. the unrealiable aspects has been fixed. all the previous ls/vtec setup back in the days had some bugs in it -- i.e. improper lines, improper installations, improper machine work that was necessary for the vtec head to be swapped to the ls block. the only unreliable things that i keep hearing about ls/vtecs are the ones that didn't do the job right -- leading to oil leaks here and there. even installing the headgasket wrong.
i've had and ls/vtec for 3 years back then and it was stock. stock gsr head, stock ls bottom (with 137,000 miles), gsr oil pump, ls water pump, ls timing belt. i even squeezed 55 shot of nitrous in it and it still held. no oil leaks, no nothing. just oil changes every 3000 miles.
now i have a fully built b20/vtec for almost a year now and i don't have any problems with it. the setup is just like an ls/vtec, but with more displacement, and bigger bore, and all that good stuff."
You'll get anywhere between 170-190 hp at the wheels for an ls/vtec swap (depends on your mods). An Teg Type R only has about 160-165 at the wheels from the factory. Look at my sig. That's my plan.
__________________ F/S: OBD-IIb to OBD-I conv harness. 96-00 Civic camber kit. PM for details.
99 Si-T: Ran a 13.87 @ 102.34mph. Full int, w a/c & p/s, on 17" street tires, and a full exhaust (no open downpipe) @ 6.5psi of boost. Check out my old Si-T
Totalled my All Motor GSR 10/1/05
What you also need to do is look at how much you want to spend on your car and how fast you want it to go, all things being equal (cams, compression, boltons) a b18c motor will be slightly slower than a ls/vtec motor, this is for 2 reasons, the LS bottom has a longer stroke, giving it better torque, and has 34 (pretty sure) more cc's of displacement. BUT in order for your ls-vtec motor to have the same reliability as a b18c block you will have to put at least a z10 or b18c block girdle, and get your LS rods shotpeened and arp rod bolts to hold everything together. All this work will cost you bout 500-700 bucks not to mention whatever it costs you to rebuild your bottom end while you have everything taken apart, not to mention you need to get high compression pistons to fully take advantage your setup.
__________________
90 Integra LS
-I/H/E
-Neuspeed strut bar
-Neuspeed sport springs 1.8" drop
What I don't ubdertstand is why bother putting the VTEC head on a LS block when the GSR Block was made for the VTEC head?
I mean if you get it working and all, GREAT? But at what cost to insure its reliabilty? On top of that you would have spent so much money to make it work. People always say that a LS/VTEC when done right is faster then a GSR, but you have to do so much to it. Get all the special parts just to make it work. If you got all those same parts for the GSR, I would think that it would be faster and less on your pocket.
Mods: altezzas, dual dragger exhaust, ac strut bar, aem cai w/bypass valve, type r shift knob, pedals, VELOX SCYTHES 17" SILVERpioneer HU
the way i see it is, if u have a ls engine, you would spend at least 3k for a gsr engine. and at the same time, u could spend around 3k and have a good ls/vtec setup for that same amount of money, the difference is u have more power for the same amount of money, and u get to tell people "yeah, i have lsvtec, so suck it!!!" that would be fun
Originally posted by fergie124 the way i see it is, if u have a ls engine, you would spend at least 3k for a gsr engine. and at the same time, u could spend around 3k and have a good ls/vtec setup for that same amount of money, the difference is u have more power for the same amount of money, and u get to tell people "yeah, i have lsvtec, so suck it!!!" that would be fun
I mean its fine if you wnat to be different and it works out for you. Just wondering why bother when you can have the whole system working from the start rather than starting from scratch.
More power? Where does the more power come from. Its still a 1.8 liter.
Mods: b20/vtec with jdm ITR conversion (mugen fascia)
[quote]Originally posted by fergie124 the way i see it is, if u have a ls engine, you would spend at least 3k for a gsr engine. and at the same time, u could spend around 3k and have a good ls/vtec setup for that same amount of money, the difference is u have more power for the same amount of money, and u get to tell people "yeah, i have lsvtec, so suck it!!!" that would be fun[/QUOTE
there ya go. i said almost the exact same lines maybe a year ago when the older version of SHO had a little debate about ls/vtec vs. gsr vs. itr.
gsr and ITR engines are way overpriced (i'm not saying that it should be priced like an ls). since gsr and itr engines don't come around that often (especially itr), prices for these engine go up -- simple "supply and demand" economics principle. it is very obvious that ls and b20 engines are way cheaper than vtec engines. so the money u save can go to "properly" build and ls/vtec or b20/vtec.
gsr and itr engines are also great candidates for monster build-up don't get me wrong. in sum, pick ur poison. it's ur money, it's ur goal, and if u have questions where here to help and give u our most "educated" info and/or guesses.
I want your opinion on this since you are a LS/VTEC B20/VTEC person. How much did you spend after you were finished with your VTEC head swap? I mean everything just to make it work and up and running?
I can understand more power from a B20/VTEC, but a LS/VTEC?
Mods: b20/vtec with jdm ITR conversion (mugen fascia)
Quote:
Originally posted by sak
I mean its fine if you wnat to be different and it works out for you. Just wondering why bother when you can have the whole system working from the start rather than starting from scratch.
More power? Where does the more power come from. Its still a 1.8 liter.
if u already have a gsr and want to build it that's great. and i really mean it. i've seen bad-ass built gsr monster all motor engines. but to those who don't have the ls, rs, gs model then why not build a bad-ass ls/vtec motor also -- for the price of purchasing a gsr or itr engine u will produce more power building an ls/vtec.
even people who already have gsrs pt for the ls/vtec option. look at it this way. if u have a daily driven gsr, the only car u have, and want to build it. u will, of course, take out the engine have the shop build it for u, wait for parts, etc. this would equal a long downtime for the owner. especially if he/she uses the car for daily commute to work, school, what-have-you.
now if u go ahead and purchase an ls engine, take it to the shop, have em build it, put all the goodies in there which will take some downtime too. but u don't have to worry about bumming a ride or taking public transportation since u have the gsr to drive around. which is convenient. when the ls/vtec is all done and u already swapped it in. u have a precious gsr engine sitting in ur garage that'll sell quickly. and u almost paid some money for the ls/vtec build-up from selling that gsr motor.
like i said earlier, "pick ur poison". be it built gsr, built ITR, built ls/vtec. it is totally up to the owner's decision on what he/she wants to do with the money or what kind of goal is being attained. and that as they say, is that.
Mods: b20/vtec with jdm ITR conversion (mugen fascia)
Quote:
Originally posted by sak I want your opinion on this since you are a LS/VTEC B20/VTEC person. How much did you spend after you were finished with your VTEC head swap? I mean everything just to make it work and up and running?
I can understand more power from a B20/VTEC, but a LS/VTEC?
i paid 1000 for just the vtec head swap. that included the gsr head, gsr ecu, labor, parts. basically a stock setup. Miles from TRICKSPEED in Sacramento did the swap for me 4 years ago.
i spent around 4 - 5000 (maybe more) dollars for my b20/vtec setup.
--1100 for the b20 longblock
-- 600 for machine shop labor
-- 1500 for toda spec b's, toda gears, toda springs, titanium retainers.
--500 for headwork
-- 280 for rc 310cc injectors
-- 600 for the engine swap
-- 300 hondata stage 2
--$$ moroso oil catch can
there's still more but u get the idea.
i got some money back from selling the b20 head for 200 and the ls block with gsr oil pump for 300.
Mods: b20/vtec with jdm ITR conversion (mugen fascia)
Quote:
Originally posted by sak $8542 for the whole thing?
Yeah thats what they paid for theirs, but about how much did you pay for yours? About the same? A lot less? A lot more?
$8 grand just seems to be a little much for a motor thats not fully built yet.
I'm not bashing on the LV/VTEC B20/VTEC. Just wondering why they bother going through the trouble thats all.
i can see ur concern. but that's how it goes. it'll just depend if u can get some good deals or if u do most of the labor urself. that's their money, their goals, their satisfaction.
B18C1 or ls/vtec
http://www.trumotorsports.com
Linear Mode
