I got this site a while ago on how to build a custom turbo kit http://coolazz.tripod.com/turbo.html. I am definetly going to go this route, and use these instructions.
I would just like to know what are some things I can do to increase my security of knowing that my car isn't going to blow up when i rev on it? Keeping it within a reasonable budget. I just read in a recent post that the most common reason for boosted handa motors blowing up is due to leaning out.
In those instructions he uses a boost sensitive FMU. Would a bigger fuel pump and bigger injectors be a good idea...or is it not neccesary on 6-8lbs of boost? And if so, what size of injectors should I get...and out of what car should I get them?? And do I want an in-tank or in-line fule pump? Is a bigger fuel rail needed?
All of these questions are related to the turbo setup in the web site, a T3 turbo running 6-8lbs of boost.
You may have to copy and paste the adress in your adress bar and delete the period at the end to get the web site to work if anyone wants to check it out.
Well, you definately want to get a boost controller to know how much you're boosting, and you should get your engine rebuilt (recommended if you want to go above usually 8-10 PSI (varies with different engines)).
Also, you will need a air/fuel mixture device and having this, you SHOULD get your car tuned at a professional shop if you wanna be safe.
Originally posted by integ3 I got this site a while ago on how to build a custom turbo kit http://coolazz.tripod.com/turbo.html. I am definetly going to go this route, and use these instructions.
I would just like to know what are some things I can do to increase my security of knowing that my car isn't going to blow up when i rev on it? Keeping it within a reasonable budget. I just read in a recent post that the most common reason for boosted handa motors blowing up is due to leaning out.
In those instructions he uses a boost sensitive FMU. Would a bigger fuel pump and bigger injectors be a good idea...or is it not neccesary on 6-8lbs of boost? And if so, what size of injectors should I get...and out of what car should I get them?? And do I want an in-tank or in-line fule pump? Is a bigger fuel rail needed?
All of these questions are related to the turbo setup in the web site, a T3 turbo running 6-8lbs of boost.
Thanks for any help or any replies.
add a turbo timer to increase the life of your turbo and to keep the oil line from clogging up.
at 6-8 psi, you really do not need bigger injectors yet nor a higher output fuel pump, but if you wnat to increase the performance and reliability of your turboed B18, you should go ahead get bigger injectors and a 255 LPH in-tank fuel pump. it'll be worth it, trust me. an 440cc at a minimum or a DSM 450cc with resistor combo. your stock fuel rail will be fine. to effectively increase a fuel flow on a slightly to mediumly modified car is actually to increase the injector size.
Well, I don't want to rebuild the engine because that will cost probibly about twice as much as i'm going to spend on the turbo kit...plus i plan on staying in the 6-8lbs of boost range.
thermalfi'd16, where, or out of what car can I get DSM 450cc injectors? And what is a resistor combo?? I also heard that a Walbro 255 LPH in-tank fuel pump was the way to go...around $100, sound good?
I just want to drive with the peice of mind that my engine isn't going to lean out, detonate, and blow up....in another words build a reliable turbo set up, since it's not a kit.
Mods: JDM ITR FE conversion. All-motor goodies. Hondata system.
Quote:
Originally posted by integ3 Well, I don't want to rebuild the engine because that will cost probibly about twice as much as i'm going to spend on the turbo kit...plus i plan on staying in the 6-8lbs of boost range.
thermalfi'd16, where, or out of what car can I get DSM 450cc injectors? And what is a resistor combo?? I also heard that a Walbro 255 LPH in-tank fuel pump was the way to go...around $100, sound good?
I just want to drive with the peice of mind that my engine isn't going to lean out, detonate, and blow up....in another words build a reliable turbo set up, since it's not a kit.
Thanks for the replies yall, greatly appreciated.
Go read this thread here on SHO. It'll help you in your quest for information with the questions you've asked.
I used that link you found for my blueprint to do my turbo. Trust me...whomever did that site did a good job putting the "how-to" part together on it, but they weren't realistic in putting the prices down on there. Seriously, are you really going to spend a couple hundred bucks on a turbo from a junkyard? Just spend a few hundred bucks more and get a new turbo. That site was good for information and helpful when I went to do my install. However, don't follow that site exactly for everything you do. You best bet is to research a lot more. Read every thread in the turbo forum about building a turbo kit. Talk to people who have already turbo'd their car, ask informed questions. What I mean is don't just ask broad questions like "what will work best?" cause everyone will tell you something a little different. Your best bet is to research info yourself and ask specific questions like "is a .82 a/r exhaust housing too large for my 1.8L if I plan on auto-crossing my car? or If I used one with a .82 exhaust a/r how much turbo lag will I have?"
To answer your other questions: DSM 450cc/min injectors. You can get them from a 1st Gen. Turbo Eclipse 5spd as well as a 2nd Gen. Turbo Eclipse 5 spd. The 1 gen ones are better though. The resistor pak is "a resistor pak" that you'd use if you have low ohm injectors (peak and hold injectors). Check out this site and you'll understand it better. http://www.hondata.com/techinjectorwiring.html
If you decide to keep your stock injectors, definitly upgrade your fuel pump to a 255 lph one, get an FMU and use it. An FMU is explained on that Turbo 101 site you have. You won't have a problem running lean if you use an FMU with 12:1 ratio and a stock fuel pressure of 35 psi. Don't expect your injectors to work very well above 6psi of boost. At 6psi and a 12:1 FMU your fuel pressure will be 72 + 35 = 107psi. That's pretty high! If you got 270cc/min injectors (check the Prelude forum cause some Preludes used 270cc injectors) and you can lower your fuel pressures.
Just go read www.hondata.com/tech.html and you'll learn a lot. This will help you in your research. Remember, a well informed tuner will have fewer mistakes than someone who just "does it". To be honest...if you want peace of mind...get a Hondata! That, or go read the thread I mentioned at the start of this post.
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Yep!
__________________ F/S: OBD-IIb to OBD-I conv harness. 96-00 Civic camber kit. PM for details.
99 Si-T: Ran a 13.87 @ 102.34mph. Full int, w a/c & p/s, on 17" street tires, and a full exhaust (no open downpipe) @ 6.5psi of boost. Check out my old Si-T
Totalled my All Motor GSR 10/1/05
uoboarder, you said "Don't expect your injectors to work very well above 6psi of boost".
So are you saying that the prelude 270cc/min injectors would be enough for a 6-9lbs of boost? And i'm guessing that you don't need the resistor pack with the prelude injectors...right? Or are the 450cc/min injectors needed for ANY ammount of boost?
Sorry if it sounds like i'm asking a question on something you already covered in you previous reply, I just didn't understand your wording.
One more thing, I know that you and other people have said that the hondata is the best way to go...but for my application, and my budget (cheap ass), would the 12:1 FMU along with the bigger injectors and the 255 LPH fuel pump be good enough for a reliable set up? I plan to stay in the 6-9 lbs of boost rage.
Thanks again for the advice, i'd rather find out my problems on the web board, rather than finding them out after I install my turbo.
you easily get a set of DSM 450cc injectors from ebay or www.DSMtrader.com for about $60-80. i pulled out a set from an plymouth Laser and cost me $23.75. The injectors are available from all 4 cylinder DSM turbo car like the Eclipse GST/GSX, Talon Tsi, and Plymouth Laser. These are the part number that you're looking for:
1G: B450L INP-009
2G: MDL450 INP-018
the part number are on the plastic section of the injectors. you'll need a resistor box from an older honda or in-line resistors. hit me up. i'll send you a picture of how these resistor boxes look like and the schematic for wiring the injectors.
Mods: JDM ITR FE conversion. All-motor goodies. Hondata system.
Quote:
Originally posted by integ3 uoboarder, you said "Don't expect your injectors to work very well above 6psi of boost".
So are you saying that the prelude 270cc/min injectors would be enough for a 6-9lbs of boost? And i'm guessing that you don't need the resistor pack with the prelude injectors...right? Or are the 450cc/min injectors needed for ANY ammount of boost?
Sorry if it sounds like i'm asking a question on something you already covered in you previous reply, I just didn't understand your wording.
One more thing, I know that you and other people have said that the hondata is the best way to go...but for my application, and my budget (cheap ass), would the 12:1 FMU along with the bigger injectors and the 255 LPH fuel pump be good enough for a reliable set up? I plan to stay in the 6-9 lbs of boost rage.
Thanks again for the advice, i'd rather find out my problems on the web board, rather than finding them out after I install my turbo.
I think 240cc injectors would require a 10:1 calibration in the FMU for minimum performance. I do not know if the Prelude 270ccs require a resitor pak or not. I do know that if you had 270cc injectors you could drop in a 8:1 disk in the FMU and not worry about running lean. 8 x 9psi is 72. Add 72 to the stock fuel psi of 36 and you have a maximum fuel pressure of 108psi. So at 6psi you'll have 48 + 36 = 84psi of fuel pressure while on boost. I think this is a tollerable level of fuel pressure for slightly larger than stock injectors. Make sure you get yourself a 255 lph inline or intank fuel pump though.
If you ran 450cc injectors you'd have plenty of fuel, but you'd have to have your ecu recalibrated. 450s are too large w/o recalibrating. Not only that but if you used 450s on the stock fuel maps and ignition maps w/o reburning or recalibrating the ecu than you'll be getting like 15 mpg. That's a lot of premium fuel to be using. The largest I would go is 310cc with a 6:1 disk in the FMU, 255 lph fuel pump, stock ecu, and a MAP check valve since you won't be running a Hondata.
Think of injector sizes in relation to boost like this. The bigger the injectors the lower your fuel pressure needs to be. The bigger the injector the more fuel you can push with higher boost levels. For example... my fuel pressure is at 38psi. I have a stock fuel pump. I have 450cc injectors. I know I could safely push my boost level to 9psi easily. If I was running 25psi of of boost on a built engine at a stock fuel pressure of 40psi I would need 900cc injectors at least.
So to answer your final question you had (if I hadn't already) 270cc injectors (you'll have to check the prelude forums to see if you'll need an injector resistor pak or not), 255 lph fuel pump, FMU with 8:1 disk (10:1 or even as high as 12:1) will work. I think you'll even be running rich with an 8:1 disk. You can get a calibration kit from Vortech for like $50 or so. Go check out the www.hondata.com/tech.html to learn more about this. They've done lots of research on fuel in relation to boost. Just go check out their site and see if that helps even more.
__________________ F/S: OBD-IIb to OBD-I conv harness. 96-00 Civic camber kit. PM for details.
99 Si-T: Ran a 13.87 @ 102.34mph. Full int, w a/c & p/s, on 17" street tires, and a full exhaust (no open downpipe) @ 6.5psi of boost. Check out my old Si-T
Totalled my All Motor GSR 10/1/05
Thanks uoboarder, appreciate all the advice. I looked at the hondata web site and about 3/4 of the info on there flew right over my head...i'm going to have to spend some quality time on that web site, i'm still a newbie to all of this.
One more thing, are these combonations of injector and disk sizes along with the ammount of boost I plan on useing personal expierences of yours, or are they just common knowledge? I'm assuming this is stuff that I can learn from the hondata site...right?
u'll run super rich if ur using the lude 280cc injectors with the 12:1 fmu, i know this cause i had this setup in my hx with the 255 intank pump...the a/f was down to about 8:1 a/f above 5k and i was not making anypower but losing it.
so now im back to my stock 240cc injectors and seems to be running fine...although hadn't gone back to the dyno yet.
oh and im only running 6psi on my greddy kit.
so u should be good fuel wise if u go the dsm injector/hack route or u can run lude injectors wit the 10:1 fmu (not confirmed though) the lude injectors are straight plug and play...dunno about the dsm/resistor pack though...some kinda wirings involved i just dont know since i don't have first hand exp.
Cool, that's what I wanted to hear about the lude injectors, sure that they are a straight swap for the b18b injectors in my teg? That resistor pack plan sounds kinda' shotty. And plus for the ammount of boost i'm planning on running I think that 450cc injectors isn't really needed.
Originally posted by integ3 Cool, that's what I wanted to hear about the lude injectors, sure that they are a straight swap for the b18b injectors in my teg? That resistor pack plan sounds kinda' shotty. And plus for the ammount of boost i'm planning on running I think that 450cc injectors isn't really needed.
Thanks bro.
well the resistor pack/ dsm combo isnt shoddy if u do it right thas all... alot of people are running that...but yeah the lude injectors are straight up plug and play on the ls motor
peace
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