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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Alright guys... you've helped out before, but this one I think will stump ALL of you. I am going to give you ALL the details because who knows it might be needed. I don't mean to sound sarcastic but there has been 3 dealerships, Jackson Racing, and tons of friends/family involved in trying to figure out the problem, and we can't figure it out. Here goes...

Okay, I drive a white 1995 Honda Civic EX. I have a Jackson Racing Supercharger running at 6lbs. AEM intake, Naxos exhaust, catco hiflow cat, valve cover breather. Some others that aren't important. Now, my car was taken in to the shop for some maintenance and I got it back. Well I drove it home one day and it was over heating when I pulled in my driveway. I took it back the next day to the dealership and they said the thermostat was sticking. They replaced the thermostat and a week or two after they did that it started to smoke. It would smoke when I started the car. It was almost an instant smoke. Now, the smoke was bluish gray, so we thought it was oil. It usually burns blackish because it's set real rich for the supercharger. This was definitely not a rich fuel smoke. It was almost an oil smoke. So we called the dealership back and told them what was going on. We told them the car is smoking "REALLY BAD", I mean so bad the smoke filled the street (LITERALLY... NO JOKE). I took it back and they had it for a long time, week or so and called me back and they said they couldnt get it to smoke. and the only smoke they did get was from condensation. Well, I picked it up and sure enough no smoke. Well, a few days later, I had a hiflow cat put on the car. I had no problems. Another few days goes by and there was SMOKE again. Same color. Same time after I started the car it filled the street with smoke. This time it seemed a bit worse than before. It kept coming out and wouldnt stop. The dealership told me to take a picture of it to show them the smoke color and such, so I did that and took it back to them. Same thing, they said it checked out great on the head gasket tests and compression tests. and that it had to be just condensation build up. Well, the next instance I had, I started the car up and friends told me that the smoke was a yellowish color, which to me sounds like sulfur, and again it filled the entire street when I drove it. Again they rain lots of checks on the car, tested the cat, tested the head gasket, etc. No leaks found visibily. And it kind of just stopped for a while. I didn't have much of a problem since, which has been maybe a month at most 2 months. NOW..... I get in the car, I start it up, and there is no smoke. BUT when the car gets just above the COLD engine temp line, whether I am driving it or it is in park, as soon as it warms up a tad, IT'S SMOKING WORSE THAN BEFORE!!!! And it's bluish smoke again. This time the smell of the smoke can STILL be smelt inside the car. The windows were rolled up and you could smell the smoke from the exhaust. (NO AC on either.) I have seen lots of condensation, but the smoke is definitely smoke, its not steam. It leaves a residue on the car and makes your hands smell of the smoke after you touch it. I noticed the cat has a rusty look to it, but it did when they told me it was fine. I am going to call them back this afternoon. They said that they could tear down the head and physically check the gasket, but the tests show it's fine, and they said it may just not be the head and to spend that money on physically checking it would be crazy. I need you guys to help me out here... what do you think it is?? I have no antifreeze dropage, Oil is the same level... No evidence of any kind of leaking except for a a few spots in the drive way. My family thinks its the angle my car sits in the driveway causing all the unburnt fuel and water to go towards the back of the exhaust and burn when it gets heated up. It's been doing this new thing where it burns and smokes after it's warmed up for about 4 days now in a row. I have no idea what it is... no one else seems to either, not even jackson racing techs, or the locals around here.

I am wondering if changing the exhaust would do any good, What I mean by changing the exhaust is getting headers, this way I could check the old headers for oil residue, etc, changing out the muffler (getting a different one) and checking all the welds around the cat, pipes etc. Any suggestions???
I appreciate your help!!
 

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Could you say that again in 500 words or less? Just kidding. Sounds like everbody has checked for the obvious causes. Now, you've got to think outside the box. First - something is getting into and through the exhaust to cause the smoke. Second - it seems like it's something different each time. Third - it doesn't appear to be any of the fluids (oil, antifreeze, etc) in you car. Although you didn't mention brake fluid. So, just to be sure, check all the fluids in your car. Also, back your car into the driveway for a couple of weeks to eliminate the driveway angle issue. The next time it smokes put a glass jar near the exhaust to capture some of the gas. Then, have it tested. That will tell you what it is. Then, you'll need to figure out where it's coming from. I know that doesn't answer the question, but it gives you more things to try.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Ok ... new developments as of today....

I went and checked my oil. it was low about a quart, but get this... my OIL dipstick reeks of gasoline! Is that piston rings??? Also, the guy said it could be an injector stuck open, but that doesn't make sense because the car runs FINE... when i first had the JRSC instaled the engine surged REALLY BAD... but they seemed to have fixed that. I use 93 octane gas, from chevron and I will try parking different as of tonight and see if it makes a difference. Though there is lots of water coming out of the exhaust, but the smoke is not white, it's blue/gray!
 

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I went and checked my oil. it was low about a quart, but get this... my OIL dipstick reeks of gasoline! ... when i first had the JRSC instaled the engine surged REALLY BAD...


Just a few notes....
1. A quart of low oil can be significant. Esp if your seeing smoke no matter what color you "seeing" Also the gasoline smell doesn't sound good.

2. The surging in JRSC is generally associated with a vacume leak of some kind.

So .. If I was you.. I would change oil and watch carefully. Also.. I noticed you said you changed out the CAT. and later noticed yellow smoke. Perhaps its' running SO Rich and burning oil that the cat is eating it untill your burn the cat out.. IE yellow smoke. While watching oil level in your car I would really check into doing a comprehensivie pressure check/leak down check.
Good luck
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
1. This is what makes me think it may be piston rings...



2. It was determined to be a slight vaccum leak and they fixed, but you never know...

The yellow smoke was only once out of maybe 20 times. They did a leak down test and everything last time, cylinder four was the weakest link, but it was still 15pts within specs.
 

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Definitely some internal leak(s). Compression tests don't always tell. Especially if it's a very small leak. Does sound like rings if you've got gas smell on the dip stick. I'd still be concerned with the low oil too. You could have multiple problems here. So, fixing one thing may not correct the whole problem. Work through one issue at a time and keep monitoring the results.
 

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I would just find another low mileage motor and throw that in. You can usually find sohc vtecs for a couple hundred bucks, if you look around. By the time you pay someone to find and fix the problem, Im sure you'll be paying alot more than that.
 

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Slopoke said:
I would just find another low mileage motor and throw that in. You can usually find sohc vtecs for a couple hundred bucks, if you look around. By the time you pay someone to find and fix the problem, Im sure you'll be paying alot more than that.
word, this may work out best for you, and you can just put the parts back onto the new one.
 

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Hear is your answer

A supercharger on a civic, good idea..but i think that runnig 6 pounds is a little high.. What you have done is simmple burned your piston rings..

A superhcarger, basically is a mass air charge into the motor.. Now.. the good thing about a supercharger is that there is power on hand all the time.. Unlike a turbo, wheich has turbo lag.. now also, just like a turbo.. you should beef up the internals... Even a turbo kit for your car reccommends that you only run 5 lbs of boost on stock internals.. So you simply burned your rings.. causing oil to get into the piston chamber... where its is burning out and being blown out the exhaust, causing a loss in oil.. and of course if oil can go into the piston chamber, we all know that unburned fuelcan get out of the piston chamber in the same place the oil entered.. ie, the smell of fuel in the oil...

What you can do before changing your exhaust.. is put your car on a level surface.. like a nice parking lot, that is not black top... start your car.. rev it up a few times... then turn it off.. go look at the ground behind the muffler.. and bet you 100 bucks there is black oil on the ground where the exhaust is spraying it out..

E-mail me at [email protected] if you wanna chat some more

yahoo messenger is dgrobe2112

PEash
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Re: Hear is your answer

Yes it is a great idea, BUT... the D16 series engine (in civics) is actually much stronger than many think. No internal mods are needed to be done up to about 8lbs of boost. Anything over 8lbs is pushing it. Anyway, I see your point and that's a very good assumption based on the information. Though.... With your oil out the exhaust theory... I've already done that, but I've one up'ed you :) I put the car in the drive way at an angle with the engine angled higher than the exhaust. I did rev it up a few times after it was warmed up, and yes, fluid did come out of the exhaust, but it was all just condensation, though black, still just condensation. The main problem isn't exactly that I have a problem, it's the problem of trying to diagnose what the REAL problem is... that's the hardest part, because there are NO true signs of what it is. It has symptoms of just about everything that could go wrong with a car. :)
 

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By putting the car on an uneven surface you dont get the rihgt oil pickupi form the oil pump... now.. i am almost positive your rings are leaking.. causiing blow by.. i guearentee if you go and get a leakdown test done on the motor, you will see that the rings are leaking... Your rihgt.. 8 lbs is ok mainly on the dx model... the stronger bottom end... now also, there is a big difference in 8 lbs on a turbo, and 8 lbs on a supercharger.. a turbo doesnt hit 8 lbs unless you ar on the throttle hard.. a supercharger is designed to give you instant power at the push of the throttle... since it runs on pulleys...
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
A month ago the leak down test showed nothing. Though I did some calling today, and told them what's up. The car is now smoking instantly when the car is started. I told everyone about the gas smell i nthe oil and a couple people have told me that the intake gasket or the head gasket is bad. Just tested the theory you had about oil out the exhaust on level ground, nothing came out not even condensation. On the supercharger, the boost doesn't kick in until you hit 3200rpms.

dgrobe2112 said:
By putting the car on an uneven surface you dont get the rihgt oil pickupi form the oil pump... now.. i am almost positive your rings are leaking.. causiing blow by.. i guearentee if you go and get a leakdown test done on the motor, you will see that the rings are leaking... Your rihgt.. 8 lbs is ok mainly on the dx model... the stronger bottom end... now also, there is a big difference in 8 lbs on a turbo, and 8 lbs on a supercharger.. a turbo doesnt hit 8 lbs unless you ar on the throttle hard.. a supercharger is designed to give you instant power at the push of the throttle... since it runs on pulleys...
 

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I bet it is the rings with the fuel smell, had the same problem on my 74 2002 BMW, compression was great on all cylinders but was having the smoking problem (bluish). It wasn't as heavy as you are exclaiming on yours but it was evident. Oil had a gas smell to it, and lost oil too. Its gotta be the rings, but as much smoke as you are exclaiming could be doing more damage. How long did you say you've been running the supercharger on the car? Also do you do any major drag/sport track/street racing on a regualr basis? If you haven't beefed up the internals even with 6lb from the charger at 3200 if you are driving realy heavy for quite some time, that would definitely lead to breakdown. Keep us updated.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Unfortunately... it is a LOT of smoke. The strangest thing is though, it never smoked ... NEVER until they changed out the thermostat. I one day started the car <on a hot day> after getting my hair cut, and it just smoked and smoked and smoked. When I drive down the street I feel like im the Spy Hunter (old school video game) spraying smoke screen behind me. I street race only on saturday nights. Rarely am I ever a hard ass or racing someone other than on that night. I am going to see what the dealership says on monday or tuesday and see what they recommend for safegaurding this from happening again.
 

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it does sound like piston rings, but at the same time, the symptoms arnt the same. With most ring problems, there is smoke right at startup, then as it heats up, the rings expand, and no more smoke. i say you pull off the heads, and pop ou the pistons (you can take out the pistons with the engine in the car) and replace the rings. while you've got the heads off, check the cylinder walls for cracks. you should see these because they'll have anitfreeze residue around them. replace head gasket, and put it all back together, then see if something is still wrong. even if replacing the rings doenst help, you have eliminated one variable, so you can concentrate on other causes.
 

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I agree, after the car was warmed up the smoke did go away, and you are exclaiming that the smoke is constant. The rings might be part of the problem, but *gosh there is so much stuff in there* (blonde sound..hehehe). I think you should take the pistons out, check for cracks and any warping that may have occured.
 

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ok man try this...its worth the $6 to try it.
when i 1st got my zc swap it was fine then it appeared that i blew the headgasket. so instead of replacing the gasket first i saw this stuuf in autozone call "block seal". its like lil copper thingys that plug leaks and cracks. It comes in alil clear bottle and the stuff is copper in color. I follwed the instructions and wattya know no more smoke!! i figured it wouldnt last so i drove it anyway and I STILL AM. no more oil comsuption or smoke. I also had oil in my radiator healed all that stuff!!

so my advice is the look in ur radiator overflow and the raditor when its cold. so if any oil is in there it will float to the top and ull see it. Then go try this block seal stuff for the hell of it! cant do anymore damge than wats been done.
 
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