Ok my car is in need of brakes desperately. Rotors are shot and pads also. I was looking for a good brake kit to go with but I don't want anything bigger. I have tried looking but came back empty handed.
so i don't care, ASE certification doesn't mean anything to me. my dads an airplane mechanic and some of his new employees are all certified but still dont' know crap about single props. and how many horror stories have we all heard about honda dealership mechanics which are all ASE certified as well.Prelude92Si said:IM sorry to burst your bubble but me know a thng or 2 about brakes and have machined slottled rotors u can and they still funtion as effectivly as they did before and as for warping rotors u can warp any rotor so bad u can machine it to the proper parrelism.... u have to use a gauge and spin the rotor and see how many thousands it out of parrel if u can machine so many thousands off to make it the same all the way around u can but if not sorry any rotor is SOL... and about the calipers i never said anything about calipers... stock Oem Honda calipers are great never had any problems with them.. and if they run stock factory rotors then thy use Hawk pad the pads are eventually goinng to chew them up... Oh and i am ASE brake certified.. thanks..
ok. so don't get the hp plus's. regular hawk pads won't do this, i know because i had the hawks on the car before. it would still dust like crazy but i never thought it "ate" at the rotors.Prelude92Si said:a brake salesman told me that the pads will eat up the stock weak rotors..
could be an image thing for the purchasers of the cars. they spend a lot on the car, they want something that looks expensive. maybe.94PreludeJDM said:I've heard this argument so many times, and this is the conclussion I've drawn: Drilled and slotted rotors aren't necessary for our cars, and may eat up pads, wear out faster, etc. But I refuse to believe that they are worse at stopping your car. No, I don't have any articles or anything to back it up, but there's got to be a reason why Porsches, Ferraris, Lambos, Vettes, and some of the other best performing cars in the world have them, stock. I'm not talking about some crap rotors, they have to be quality, but they obviously work well or else these companies wouldn't use them. Keep in mind though, that the less surface area is made up by the size of the rotors, because usually these cars have a pretty sizeable rotor. Just my 2 cents.
actually.IHIPrelude94 said:The reason that the high end cars and race cars have them is because they will see the extreme braking situations that we won't. If you're in a Ferrari ripping up a road course, your rotors and pads are going to get hot as hell, and yes they will release more gas than they would under conditions that our car would see. They're braking harder and from much higher speeds than our cars can. If you think about it from a scientific perspective, cross drilled and slotted rotors provide less surface area on the the rotor which would mean less stopping power. High end cars have bigger rotors, and bigger calipers meaning that they can add brake pad/rotor surface area where they meet allowing for increased braking while still getting the benefits provided by the rotors.
"The Working of Brakes"
Over the past several years I have seen many myths perpetrated by the main stream. The purpose of this article is to dispel some of those myths while explaining basic concepts. Through the course of this article you will learn about how brakes work. You will also learn the advantages and disadvantages of cross-drilled, slotted, and vented rotors. Lastly, you will learn about brake bias.
There is a common fallacy out there that increasing your brake pad size in terms of swept area will increase the stopping power of your car through greater friction. From a standpoint ignoring operating temperatures this is in fact false. The force of friction is determined by physics as the force down on the object times the coefficient of friction. As such there is no surface area in the friction equation. However, the temperature of the pad varies throughout its use changing the coefficient of friction at each point along its temperature slope in a non-linear/non-progressive manner. As such it is possible that a larger pad will change the friction force favorably given pad makeup. It certainly will change the amount of time before the brakes enter the proper range and when they leave the range. It will also influence when and how long it is at the peak performance point. Meanwhile, modifying the pad material can change this operating range. As such the affect of increase in pad size on braking friction would depend on the makeup of the pad. Also note that the only way to modify the force down is to change the brake piston force (by size changes or number for example).
This does not mean that a larger brake pad does not help braking! The benefit of a large brake pad comes into effect when you consider thermal dissipation. The larger the pad the more this thermal temperature (created by the interaction between the pad and rotor) is spread amongst a pad. This means less temperature is concentrated at one point on the pad and the rotor absorbs more heat. This decreases the likelihood that the pad itself will heat beyond operating temperature. If the pad were to go beyond operating temperature it would glaze over resulting in brake fade. Furthermore, a larger pad results in a longer service life of the pad since there is more pad material to consume.
**Note: This is not to say that a huge pad is the way to go. I am simply telling you the benefits of a bigger pad. Do not. I repeat do not buy a huge pad thinking that will be the end all. However, consider a pad with a better material makeup for a large difference.
So what do cross drilled and slotted rotors accomplish? The main original purpose of slotted and cross-drilled rotors was to vent gases that buildup between the pads and the rotors. However, this reasoning is no longer valid. As the years have gone by pads have been designed that produce very little gas. Furthermore many pads come with groves in themselves that allow for the removal of any minor gas that is created. A slotted or drilled rotor always decreases the rotors capability to dissipate heat amongst itself. A slotted or drilled rotor will also clean off the brake pad as it passes the slots at the expense of faster pad wear. As such there are benefits for rally and dirt tracks. Furthermore, the slots or holes themselves can serve to wipe off the top layer of glaze that tends to appear on your brake pads. Some racers say this last part is beneficial while others question whether the slots will fill before the deglaze affect is ever helpful. I have yet to determine the answer to this question.
The answer of slotted and cross-drilled rotor usefulness seems to lie with whether the benefit of cleaning the pads outstrips the loss in heat dissipation. In terms of cross drilling there are so many costs that nothing is accomplished beyond perhaps giving you a certain bling look. In a motorcycle or other extremely light vehicle the decrease in rotational inertia and unsprung mass might perhaps be useful (once other more efficient avenues are exhausted). However, in a street car or race car the speeds and weight of such vehicles will make the relatively miniscule decrease be outweighed by the need for more heat dissipation. Slotted rotors, meanwhile, share the positives of cross drilling but notably are slightly less subject to the costs. They do not impede airflow through the rotors vanes, nor do they have as large an affect on structural rigidity. Therefore, the need for slotting depends on your application.