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What do you think is faster??

  • Stick

    Votes: 19 79.2%
  • Auto

    Votes: 5 20.8%
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solo-x said:
a race built automatic would be consistently faster, but nearly impossible to drive on the street with any semblance of comfort.
exactly and when it comes to street cars it's a stick that's faster if compared to the same car model. look in car and driver and motor trend and sometimes they test the stick and auto version of cars and the stick is always faster. also the auto SOMETIMES come with a lower HP rating.
 

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In summary - It all depends on the engine and tranny. In a Civic the stick is obviously faster. But, sucks when you're in bumper to bumper traffic. In high performance cars the automatics tend to be quicker. I used to own a '66 426 Hemi (575 Dyno HP) with a 4 speed. Only one time did I ever beat an automatic 426 and the guy was terrible controlling the power off the line. And - I raced every week for two years.

Hey VtecTurboHB - How do you have so many posts already? You must be replying to every thread.
 

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kcallahan said:

Hey VtecTurboHB - How do you have so many posts already? You must be replying to every thread.
I'm a whore!:eek: and what part of jax,fl u at? i went to SandalWood C/O 96. I'm moving back there when my son finishes Kindergarden cause he's a year ahead of the kids in Fl, he wouldn't be able to go to school there if we moved now cause he's too young. i lived in Monument Oaks.;)
 

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SohcVtecTurboHB said:
also the auto SOMETIMES come with a lower HP rating.
That's not really accurate. They don't change the engine based on the transmission. If the engine has a 140hp rating, then it's the same for both the stick and automatic. The only difference that occurs in horsepower is at the wheels, where the automatic can be around 5%-10% lower.

Just clarifying...
 

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mokuboy said:
That's not really accurate. They don't change the engine based on the transmission. If the engine has a 140hp rating, then it's the same for both the stick and automatic. The only difference that occurs in horsepower is at the wheels, where the automatic can be around 5%-10% lower.

Just clarifying...
ok guy:eek: go pick up a AutoMobile Mag(that's the name of it), not Superstreet or SportCompact, a real mag that gives the facts and not biased opinions, auto's do SOMETIMES come with a lower HP rating, especially domestic cars
 

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SohcVtecTurboHB said:


I'm a whore!:eek: and what part of jax,fl u at? i went to SandalWood C/O 96. I'm moving back there when my son finishes Kindergarden cause he's a year ahead of the kids in Fl, he wouldn't be able to go to school there if we moved now cause he's too young. i lived in Monument Oaks.;)
O.K., if you say so :) I live over by the Avenues Mall (Baymeadows Area) I know where Sandlewood and Monument Oaks are. If you graduated in '96 and have a kid in kindergarten you definitely have a life outside of SHO.

And...be nice to mokuboy, he's cool. Been around and helped a lot of people on SHO. I would agree with both of you actually. In the Civics the HP ratings are the same for both auto and stick. But, quite often, in the domestics the HP ratings are lower in the automatics.
 

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SohcVtecTurboHB said:
ok guy:eek: go pick up a AutoMobile Mag(that's the name of it), not Superstreet or SportCompact, a real mag that gives the facts and not biased opinions, auto's do SOMETIMES come with a lower HP rating, especially domestic cars
I'm not talking about import cars alone -- I'm talking about cars in general. If you call up a Ford dealership and ask them about the horsepower on the Focus ZX3, they don't first ask you if you're talking about an automatic or stick. They simply tell you it's 130hp with the 16V ZeTec engine. I don't need to read AutoMobile Magazine to know that...

There may be some domestic automakers that do that, but in general, the horsepower is the same for a car, at the same trim level, regardless of the transmission.
 

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automatic

I read in this magazine that this guy with an is300 took his auto and upgraded the computer and shit in it after pumping like 20g into it and left it an auto. But that auto was faster than any stick could be. But you know, he pumped in 20 g in to that shit. you get what I'm trying to say? Normally stick can beat auto, but not the expensive ass auto :p


aight, peace.
 

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mokuboy said:
I'm not talking about import cars alone -- I'm talking about cars in general. If you call up a Ford dealership and ask them about the horsepower on the Focus ZX3, they don't first ask you if you're talking about an automatic or stick. They simply tell you it's 130hp with the 16V ZeTec engine. I don't need to read AutoMobile Magazine to know that...

There may be some domestic automakers that do that, but in general, the horsepower is the same for a car, at the same trim level, regardless of the transmission.
ok cool i see your point i just wanted to get the FACT across that some manufactuers do that. I don't have an example but i have plenty of Automobile mags but i'm to lazy to go downstairs and get one hehehe, so lets squash it;)
 

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hey guys sho finally up and running :) good to be back :)

auto and stick .... performance potential wise theyre pretty much equal, auto better for drag while stick have would be better for autox imo :) stock form a manual car would always be faster and more fun to drive imo :)

ps: a stock auto supra is not faster then a 6spd :) even if you think that the turbo never stop spoolin ;)

lolz brand spankin newbie babie :)
 

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it all depends on what kind of racing your doing.....like the guy said, auto trannys are better for bracket racing. watch speed vision, a lot of those GT racers use those "sport shift" type auto trannys, so do rally racers. but overall for us everyday joes, MT is better, gear ratio wise, gas mileage wise, fun factor wise, etc. oh yea, whoever said u couldn't drift in an auto.....juss drop it down to L =) and its not just a japanese thing, its slowly growing in the US...not to mention europe (Top Gear dude is obssesed wit oversteer)...SLOWLY, its getting there tho.
 

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one more thing.......the Lexus IS300 auto was SLIGHTLY slower than the new Lesux IS300 manual.......don't knoe the EXACT time........but i think sport compact car had something on it.
 

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an example of different HP rating is B16A1 160hp in Manual trim and 153 with the Auto.:eek:
 

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also the auto SOMETIMES come with a lower HP rating.
Actually, that would make it seem like the manufacturer is actually quoting wheel horsepower, becuase automatic transmissions have higher driveline losses than a manual tranny.
 

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heres a prime example for ya, civic ex manual has 106whp, and the auto only makes 92 to the wheels..civic autos blow..for power that is...i know..i had an auto 2k ex..;)
 

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wow. people love to miss the point.

the difference between auto transmissions and manual transmissions runs deep. It's more than just the gear ratios being different, and the shift rpms being different. If the shift points were the same, and the gear ratios were the same, the MT would win, EVERY TIME, given a skilled driver of course.

now, lately with all the manu-matics out there, i need to make a further distinction between manual transmissoins and automatic transmissions. I prefer to use "clutch based transmissions" and "torque converter based transmissions."

The reason why is, an automatic that uses a clutch (as ferrari's f1 shift system and bmw's SMG II system do) is really closer to a manual transmission than an automatic transmission. These transmissions are far superior to the manumatics that use torque converters (like the ones honda, benz, nissan, etc.) use.

to understand why a clutch based transmission will be faster, you have tu understand how a torque converter works.

it's nothing more than a viscous coupling. There is an enclosed chamber with fluid between two discs that rotate along the same axis. There is nothing between these two discs other than the fluid. One disc is connected to the engine's crankshaft. the other disc is connected to the transmission. When the first disc spins, it creates a current in the fluid, this current propels the 2nd disc, and that is how the power is transferred. That of course is a HIGHLY simplified summary of how things actually work, but it's all you need to know to understand why a clutch is superior. A clutch gives MUCH better coupling between the engine and transmission. There is no "slippage" as there is in a torque converter. A torque converter is basically ALWAYS slipping. So even if you shift at redline with a torque converter, the transmission doesn't recieve the same input rpm as with a clutch at redline. Of course, there are lockup torque converters, which rigidly link the two discs in the torque converter, but lockup only occurs at cruising speeds, not during hard acceleration.

so in short, the car with the clutch will almost always beat the car with the torque converter (once again, assuming identical gear ratios).

if it's an electro-hydraulically controlled clutch (f1, smgII) then that is pretty much the ultimate combination.

torque converters are on their way out - thank goodness.
 

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oh, and the mention of CVT's is interesting.

they deserve a category of their own. theoretically, they should provide the best performance of all, since the engine RPM is held constant at the hp peak, and the transmission is wholly responsible for increasing the speed via gear ratio.

the limiting factor is the fact that the CVT relies on friction between the belt and the cone shaped "gear" shaft. This is a relatively small surface area and as a result, torque handling is severly limited. It is prone to slipping - not quite as badly as a torque converter type automatic (when new anyhow).

CVT's really don't belong in racing though, they're just not reliable enough under stress.
 

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Mojo-Jojo said:


Actually, that would make it seem like the manufacturer is actually quoting wheel horsepower, becuase automatic transmissions have higher driveline losses than a manual tranny.
OK look this rating is at the flywheel aka: engine, not the wheels!
B16A1: Manual 160hp @ 7600
B16A1: Auto 153 @ 7300

Do a search on the internet
 

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Discussion Starter #40
Shesh didn't know this post would have went on this long. I made my mind for a stick three days ago. Auto is so BOOORING. So shrug ;)
 
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