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D16Y8 intake manifold swap - tutorial!

61K views 68 replies 13 participants last post by  klungemonger  
#1 ·
If you plan to keep the Y7 computer, it's easiest to use a Y8 auto manifold and t/b since the IACV setup is the same. Of course the 5-speed manifold setup works fine too, you just need to block off the IACV opening on the back and swap the throttle rotor & spring over to your Y7 t/b.
If you use the Y8 injectors with the Y7 ecu, you will run rich though so you want to reuse your Y7 rail & injectors. Here's a rundown on how to do it, this is everything I can remember off the top of my head...sorry if it's long-winded!

Here are things to have on hand when you start the project, so you won't have to leave for the auto parts store during the middle of it:
new intake manifold gasket
Y8 manifold brace
about 5ft of 1/4" i.d. hose, suitable for fuel/vapor/coolant use.
about 2ft of 3/8" i.d. hose, same kind of stuff
premixed coolant for aluminum blocks (you're going to lose some!)
*you might want to change PCV valve while manifold is off, it's not easy to get to otherwise.
*if you've got lots of miles and never did fuel filter, nows the time while system is depressurized also.

1) Remove fuse to fuel pump, then start car. When it stalls out, turn it off and remove the negative battery cable. This is to relieve the fuel pressure. Put the fuse back so you don't forget later.

2) Pull out the IAT sensor from the Y7 airbox, remove the box & piping, Also remove the little throttle cable brackets and detach the cable from the t/b and the cable stay.

3) Put some masking tape on the injector branches and mark them 1-2-3-4 so you get them back on the right ones, then pull the plugs. Loosen and remove the fuel hose nut at the fuel rail inlet.Take off the 2 nuts holding the fuel rail on, also I think the harness clips in a couple places on the rail so unhook those clips. Pull the little hose from the regulator to the manifold then lift out the rail/injectors. (If reusing Y7 injectors, install them in the Y8 rail, or just move the Y8 purge solenoid from the Y8 rail to the Y7 rail.)

4) Remove all vacuum lines from the manifold to any other sources. Get some rags and cups handy, now you start unhooking coolant lines! Use some pliers or channel locks to pull the retaining clips down the hoses a bit, then start pulling the hoses off. Splash! Just try not to get the coolant into the injector holes.

5) Using the outside-in pattern, loosen & remove the bolts holding the manifold to the head. There's one bolt on the underside of the manifold that holds the brace onto it, I think it's an 12mm. Grope around for it and remove that too. The manifold should be able to come right out now.

6) remove the old gasket, without gouging the surface underneath. This is tedious and irritating, at least for me it was. It's easy to scratch the head, so if you've got some chemical to soften the gasket up that would be good. Remove wiring clips from the manifold brace, take the brace out too.

7) Get your new PCV valve ready by installing the 3/8" hose & clamp on it. Don't put it in yet...first, remove the small hose from the water pipe right near the PCV (this one is a gusher!) Have a stretch of 1/4" hose ready (15-18") ready to put on immediately. This coolant line will go to the IACV on the Y8 auto t/b, just like it did with your Y7.

8) If the head is cleaned up, put your new mani-gasket on and slide the head into place. Hand snug the bolts up, then start torquing them properly in order. Once it's tight, put the Y8 brace in place and tighten it to the manifold first, then tighten the bolts to the block. If you have a header or downpipe made for Y8, you should get an exhaust support brace for the Y8, it is held on under the manifold brace by the same bolts. It is oriented properly for the support bracket you see by the header collector area on Y8. Y7 is different for some reason.

9) Reconnect the fat coolant line, run a new piece of 1/4" from the IACV to the small nipple that comes off the big one. Cut the new coolant line coming from the pipe under the mani to proper length and connect it to the other IACV nipple.

10) Lightly oil the rubber injector seats, then with the injectors already in the rail, install the rail with injector connectors facing up. Tighten it down, then connect the fuel supply line and tighten it up (don't forget the washer).

11) Use another length of 1/4" hose to run from your purge cannister to the purge solenoid on the rail, then connect the other end of the PCS to the medium sized port under the larger one on the front of the manifold. the upper one is for the PCV 3/8" hose. Now push the PCV down through the hole by the middle manifold nut, go underneath and connect it to the black box. Back up top, route the PCV hose to fit the port & cut to length.

12) I think all the wiring will reconnect without modification except the PCS connector, you might have to lengthen it by 6-8". Reattach the tiny hose from regulator to the little port right near the t/b. Use a small piece of that little hose with a screw in it (or just some silicone) to block off the cruise control vac port on the back driver side of the manifold. Connect the brake booster hose to the big port on back.

13) Plug the wiring back in, make sure you don't mix up the MAP & TPS, they are the same kind of connector. I marked all connectors before removing them just to be sure.

14) Install the cable into the throttle rotor, insert it into the stay, & tighten it up solid with 2 12mm wrenches. Make sure there's no slack but that the rotor isn't open at all when not stepping on the gas.

15) After double checking to make sure everything is hooked up, and you have not crossed and coolant/vac lines, reconnect the battery cable and crank it over. It will take a few seconds to pressurize the fuel system again.

I think that's everything, it should make sense when you are looking it all over and start working on it, this should be a good guide. Hope it helps!
 
Discussion starter · #3 ·
xBenSETSfiRex said:
Really good writeup! One question. Does it matter if you use the auto manifold if you are converted to OBD1? or can you use either?
If you are going OBD1 then you will need the manual version, as there was no 3-wire IACV on any of the OBD1 vehicles. If you happen to have an auto manifold it can be tapped for the 2-wire IACV, that's what I did to mine.
 
Discussion starter · #7 ·
98civcEK said:
Hey kommon i got a quick question. i know that the y8 IM is a better performer than the y7 but how much of a gain will it actually give. i found one on ebay that is at 70+25 for shipping with the throttle body and all sensors and hoses and brace. so hopefully you see this quick cause it ends tomorrow night.
Your top end above 5000 will really improve, plus it sounds alot more wicked! That sounds like a good deal for that setup, jump on it.
 
Discussion starter · #10 ·
If you are using a manual trans version of the Y8 manifold and still using your stock Y7 ecu, then there are holes on the back of the manifold right near the throttle body that MUST be closed off! Even duct tape will work. If there aren't any holes back there just a flat spot, then you have an auto trans version of the manifold and you are fine. I can't see how your car would have ever run right if you have holes and never blocked them off. That's just too large of a vacuum leak.
 
Discussion starter · #13 ·
syc said:
have any pics to go along with your write up?
Sorry, didn't take pics, but there are pics elsewhere on the net. BTW, clean out your PM box, I tried to reply to you there...here is what I said in the PM:

Well, if you are still using the Y7 ecu you will have an issue with the idle control valve since the Y8 and aftermarket manifolds use the 2 wire IACV mounted on back of the manifold, whereas the Y7 has a 3-wire version mounted right on the throttle body. The Y7 ecu will not operate the 2-wire version (tried it!). The car should run anyhow but it won't have the higher rpms on cold starts, and it will jerk the car a bit when you let off the gas and step on it again while in gear. That's because w/o the IACV working when the throttle plate closes the engine gets air-starved instantly so it jerks (if you are out of gear you won't feel it though.) When you step on it again the rush of air makes it surge.

I recommend though getting an OBD1 conversion harness & a P06 ecu with a chip kit. You'll need any other 96-00 fuel injectors besides the one you have. Then get the 2-wire IACV for the Y8. Your fuel rail and regulator will switch over. You will also need the Y8 throttle cable bracket, that is about $6-$7 though so no biggie. Sorry to say it's not a cheap proposition but at least you will be well on the way for any future high performance build up, either all-motor or turbo.
 
Discussion starter · #15 ·
Y7 & Y8 i/m gasket is the same.

If you are keeping the Y7 ecu then you need to keep the Y7 injectors. If you use any other ecu though, you have to change to some 240cc units, as the Y7 only has 170cc and you would end up being very lean unless you really cranked up the fuel pressure. Just use stock Y8 injectors, they are still stock D16 and visibly there is no way to tell the difference.

You could probably rig up some way to use the stock Y7 IACV on the aftermarket manifold with some adapter plates and hoses. You could also just use your stock t/b and have it bored out a bit. Going back to the tutorial above, you would then just swap the rotor and spring to make it work.

PS...sometimes it's your sentbox that is full and using up all your pm space. Check that too.
 
Discussion starter · #20 ·
syc said:
is there a difference between the y7 TB and the y8 auto TB? if not, do the sensors transfer over?
The only difference is the throttle rotor & spring. You can just put a Y8 auto t/b right on and plug it up without swapping anything over. It has the Y7 IACV and all that. It's perfect for this swap. If you can't get a Y8 auto t/b you can just get the spring/rotor off any other Honda t/b and install it on the Y7 t/b.
 
Discussion starter · #24 ·
jonnytatoro said:
As you suggested I purchased the D16y8 intake, I had the D16y7 :) . The new intake came complete with injectors,throttle body,fuel rail,and all the sensors,basicily everything. You stat that if I use the D16y7 ecu it will run to rich. What do you suggest for me to do? Should I buy a D16y8 ecu and how will this effect the rest of the operation on my vehicle? Is the ecu hard to change do you need a new wiring harness etc.... I am also deleting my Cat. thanks for all your help
No, don't get a Y8 ecu. All you need to do is swap in your original Y7 injectors, that's it. You may have to extend a few of the plugs to reach sensors on the Y7 harness but you definitely do not need a new harness. Does your new manifold/throttle body setup have the idle control valve on back of the manifold, or does it have the one on the throttle body like your Y7?

The throttle body should look like your stock Y7 one, if not you will need to put the Y7 one on the Y8 manifold, then switch the throttle rotor and spring over.
 
Discussion starter · #26 ·
Yes, the mini-me is very popular and is pretty easy to do. There is lots of info if you search around. BAsically the bottom end of the Y7 and Y8 are that same, it's the head/intake that are different. Put the Y8 head/intake on the Y7 block and now you have sohc VTEC. I would suggest if you do that to get an OBD1-OBD2 conversion harness that will let you plug OBD1 ecu into your car, and use a P28 ecu that came from the 92-95 Civic EX & Si models.

OBD1 does not require a knock sensor or secondary O2 sensor, which will leave you extra wires in your engine harness that you can use for VTEC instead, and save you from having to buy a knock sensor which you would have to if you use a Y8 ecu.
 
Discussion starter · #31 ·
FERIO_SiR said:
So the P28 ECU does not require a knock sensor or secondary O2 sensor. Cool. I am just a little confused on the wirnig of the iacv and vtec. This is the guide I am going by. Thanks for the help.
BTW this is my daily car, so is all this legal?
It seems like an OK writeup for minime. Search around here somewhere, maybe in the first post I might have posted the links to the pinout diagrams which also has instructions on how to rewire the IACV, it's pretty simple.

Legality may vary from state to state...generally though, using older electronics isn't technically legal. I do it here but we have no inspections or anything. Are you doing VTEC swap with the manifold also? If not then you don't really need a P28...
 
Discussion starter · #33 ·
OnBoostD16 said:
I also got a y8 manifold im gonna be swapping over when i install the turbo kit. So i understand correctly, just use the y7 tb, block of the hole in the back on the manual manifold and im set? How important is the brace? Honda wants $60 for it, and theres no junk yards around here that have any.
You can use the Y7 t/b but need to change the spring/rotor with one from a t/b that was normally side-mounted.

I always ran the brace so I don't know what will happen without it. Too bad they raised the price, it used to be $35 for that. Go to h-t and IM a couple guys who get lots of parts...one named egjoe, the other is b18c1poweredsi (I think!)
 
Discussion starter · #37 ·
FERIO_SiR said:
Yes I am adding vtec. P2P would be legal cause it is same year or newer, right. The downside is i have to add a knock sensor and a second O2 sensor.
Thats not too hard to do is it?
No, adding a knock sensor is as simple as buying it and screwig it into the block. Do this while you have the manifold off though! Yes, use a P2P from the vintage of your car (96-98 or 99-00). If your car is a 96-newer it already has the second O2 sensor...look at your converter up in front of the engine, you will see one sensor on top and one on the bottom...the bottom one is your secondary. If you are keeping your stock exhuast manifold then just leave it all as-is. If you get a legal header for the EX then pick up an EX converter and put that secondary sensor in it, you will need to relocate that branch in the engine harness or get an extension to reach the new sensor location.

OnBoostD16 said:
cool thanks.. Just curious, would an obd1 B series LS tb work? I know they bolt right on. I have one laying in my basement. Or is the IACV not compatible?
If you convert to OBD1 and use a manual Y8 intake manifold/IACV then yes. If you keep the Y7 ecu and don't do mini-me the only direct-replacement t/b is from the Y8 automatic. Silly to buy one though, you can just take the throttle rotor and spring from the LS t/b you have and put it on your Y7 t/b. Then it will be identical to the Y8 auto version.
 
Discussion starter · #39 ·
OnBoostD16 said:
ok, makes sense.. one other question.. Whenever inspection rolls around i need to take the turbo kit off and return to obd2. If i have the 2 wire IACV, that wouldnt work with the obd2 ecu right? but the 3 wire one will work with both, or just obd2?
The 3-wire IACV is exclusive to the OBD2 Y7, and the Y8 automatic only. All other Civics/Tegs use the 2-wire version. If you put the t/b with 3-wire on it on the manifold you don't even have to take off the 2-wire one from the manifold, just unplug it. Maybe you can just put some quick-disconnects on the IACV wires so you can swap connectors in like 5 seconds. The last Boomslang OBD1 conversion harness I had there was a jumper between the 2 ecu pins that you would normally have to move wires around in, so you wouldn't even have to modify that either.

If your turbo kit has CARB E.O. exemption and can work with the OBD2 ecu (like a bolt-on Greddy kit or something) then you might not have to take it off. If you make a diy kit though you would have some issues and have to return to stock for inspection.
 
Discussion starter · #44 ·
The code for the HX manifold is P2M. But that is the least of your concerns with what you are trying to do. Transplanting an HX into another car is not really the best idea. You are getting codes because the VTEC-E in the Y5 does not run like regular VTEC in the Y8 engine. Simply putting on the HX manifold won't solve that. Only using the HX ecu will, but that will cause you new problems...primarily that the HX uses a 5-wire wideband O2 sensor and all regular Hondas use a 4-wire sensor. Also your car doesn't have a connector for the EGR valve.

Not to flame, but researching the details helps more BEFORE you buy and install a motor may not work in your car. The best option is to put the Y8 head on the HX block, use one of the manifolds you have laying around with that Y8 ecu you have. Elsewise you're in for an electrical mess. Can it be done? Sure, but not easily.
 
Discussion starter · #46 ·
Yes you can drop the Y8 head right onto that block. Was your car a Y8 stock? what happened to it? If your car was a Y8 to begin with and you have the engine harness and computer and manifolds then just put all that stuff on the Y5 shortblock and your good to go. Don't forget the knock sensor on back of the block either. This will get you back on the road, yeah it's labor doing the mechanicals but at least it's no-brainer stuff. Bolt-on, plug it in, and go.
 
Discussion starter · #54 ·
There is not specific advantage to using a Y7 block, it's just done to add VTEC to your non-VTEC Civic without pulling the whole motor. If you don't mind the labor of swapping motors and the Y8 longblock is in good shape still then it would be fine to skip the head swap. You're not really getting any noticeable compression increase with a Y7 block anyways. And if you get a good enough deal on the whole engine it could actually save money since you really should get a new headgasket and bolts when you swap heads and that will hit your budget.

As for the cars...I don't know, if you like all the amenities like moonroof and power stuff then keep the EX, but a manual tranny conversion is alot harder and more expensive than a head swap. Even if you swap an EX manual into the DX for the improved gearing that is easy and cheap.
 
Discussion starter · #59 ·
drummerboy858 said:
yeah i got it off of a 2000 ex. so how can i block them off?
You only need to block off the main inlet which should be on the manifold flange in between the #2 & #3 intake ports. I believe there is an nipple there, I would crimp it flat about half way down then fill the top part with silicone or JB weld to seal it up.